Eclipse School - Eclipse I vs Eclipse II and What CTM and Full Thickness Means

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Eclipse School  - Eclipse I vs Eclipse II and What CTM and Full Thickness Means

Eclipse School Time!


There's been a bunch of questions and confusion about what "full thickness" or CTM means, and what's an Eclipse I vs an Eclipse II. Well, I'm snowed in tonight and bored, so I went through my 2008 Export Models Catalog (non North America) and I scanned these pages to help get an idea of what any of those terms mean.


Here's what I've figured out. (At least according to this catalog, who knows what the changes are year-to-year.)



Eclipse I Model - A mahogany body with a PLAIN maple top (or more commonly an opaque finish.) Must have 4 control knobs, similar to a Les Paul.


Eclipse II Model - A mahogany body with a FIGURED (quilt or flame) maple top. Eclipse II models can have either the 4-knob or 3-knob control layout. The 3-knob versions are called USA Eclipse II (which is different than the USA Custom Eclipse models.)

USA Eclipse II - When the Export Series started including 3-knob versions of the Eclipse, ESP started calling the 3-knob style the "USA Eclipse II" to avoid confusion (lol.) The USA Eclipse II has a modified body shape which has a different, flatter lower horn.

CTM (Custom Traditional Model) - The CTM designation (at least in 2008) means the guitar has an ebony fret board and mulit-ply binding. CTM models are not necessarily full Les Paul thickness. In this catalog there were no Eclipse II models with the CTM designation, even the 3-knob USA Eclipse II models, though I think that eventually changed.

FT (Full Thickness) - Full thickness refers to the body thickness. FT Eclipses are the same thickness as a Les Paul (55mm). Most 4 knob Eclipses are still thinner than a LP. FT does not mean the guitar has the more rounded horn of the out-of-production 4 knob guitars.

In 2008, none of the USA Eclipse II models had the CTM designation, and there was no USA Eclipse I. A brief look through the older PDF catalogs on the ESP guitars web page (link) makes me think there was never a 3-knob USA Eclipse I. Your guess is as good as mine as to why that would be.


I'm not sure which year ESP decided to stop making 4-knob Eclipses available in the Export Series (you can still find a 4-knob E-II Eclipse, but it's a rarity.)


It seems that all E-II models are just called Eclipse with no number designation.

Here are some photos to help show the differences:





Here is the difference between a Full Thickness Eclipse model (in the center), a Les Paul (on the left) and a regular Eclipse (on the right.) The Full Thickness model has a 55mm thick body, which is essentially the same thickness as a Les Paul.




Here's the difference between the CTM appointments (left) and a non CTM appointed guitar (right.) The CTM model has an ebony fingerboard and the multi-ply biding on the top and around the headstock. Both of these guitars are regular thickness Eclipse II models.



Here's a close view of the more modern horn of a USA Eclipse II vs the more rounded horn of the out-of-production, 4 knob Eclipses. It's also proof that I need to dust more.




And since this comes up occasionally, here's a view of the veneer top used on the old Standard Series and current E-II guitars. Unlike the LTD guitars, which just have a veneer over the mahogany body, the SS and E-II guitars have a maple cap with the figured veneer over top.

So there you have it. I need new hobbies and a better dusting schedule. I wouldn't call myself an expert, I just have a passing interest in the model.

Here's a video of everything you just read, because who wants to read when you can watch the movie instead?


MATTHEW L.

Yes Very descriptive at the top thanks for displaying all those models!!!

 

James B.

Great post but I'm still a little confused!

I've just bought a used Eclipse today.  It looks identical to Pushead's see through black Eclipse 2 in the video, it has a 4 knob layout, was purchased new by the previous owner in Singapore in 2010.  The Volume and Tone knobs are plastic and more similar to the Les Paul nobs with the numbering.  The previous owner said it was an Eclipse 1.  It has an SS serial number.

Any idea if it's a 1 or 2?

 

Thanks!

Pushead

If it's see through black flame or quilt it's a 2, if it has a plain maple top, it's a 1.

WhiteGrizzly

Is there any rule for necks? I always thought set neck was used up until E-IIs were released but I recently saw a 08 Standard ESP with set thru neck.

Pushead

ESP kind of uses set-neck and set-through interchangeably. The neck joints are the same on all of the SS guitars. Some of the CS Eclipses are neck-through.

WhiteGrizzly

Thank you.

Craig 11

Just joined this forum, great article Pushead, I have an ESP Eclipse which I bought about 10 years ago. It’s an after sales luthier modified version to replicate the James Hetfield iron cross guitar, it’s got 3 pots and one has been changed to a switch, do you think that makes it an eclipse 1?

Your opinion would be appreciated.

Craig 11

Craig 11

Pushead

Hi Craig. It was (and still is) a 2009 Eclipse I CTM in the distressed black finish. Looks nice to me.

Craig 11

Thanks Pushead for the reply, I like it too, I just don’t play it enough, work gets in the way!

 

T B.

Just bought one of these beauties last year and it’s an absolute joy to play! I’m attempting a full setup and was just trying to figure out if the string break angle from bridge to tail needs to clear /not contact the metal. Any thoughts on this? 

Pushead

I replied to your post on my setup video as well. I've read several people give that same advice, to keep the strings from resting on the back of the bridge. I have all of my tailpieces screwed down to the top. I like the extra compliance (perceived tension) that it gives. But I can't say that I've ever compared the sound difference between touching and not touching.

Joyce R.

So, you asked what Thickness means. A piece of music has a thick texture if there are several layers of instruments. A thin texture is one in which only a few instruments play or there are only one or two melodies and harmonies.

alex o.

i know this will be a personal opinion, but are the Eclipse 2 Standard Series "not that great" due to using veneer's and not true flame tops? how do people generally feel about that considering these are full fat ESP's?

Pushead

Only you can decide that. As you can see, it hasn't bothered me. Not quite sure what you mean by "full fat ESP."

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