Need CITES Help - URGENT

Updated
Crazyfrase

Hi folks,

I am in need of some help from ESP. I have a guitar being held due to CITES issues in the UK. It appears my export permit was filled out for the wrong species of Rosewood. I need confirmation from ESP to confirm the exact species of rosewood on my guitar so I can reapply for the correct permit.

 

The guitar is a 1996 made Ouija custom shop with a rosewood board. Can someone from ESP please contact me with the species? I’m guessing Indian rosewood (dalbergia latifolia) but I need this in writing from ESP themselves. I have tried contacting them with no luck so far and it is quite urgent otherwise I fear the guitar will be seized.

 

can anyone help??

 

Thanks

Big Daddy B
Sephiroth wrote:

That's why some concrete guitar, specially collectibles ones with rosewood, have dramatically increased its price in EU / UK.You can't legally import them anymore from outside EU/UK.

 

Hope this clears things out: https://reverb.com/news/new-cites-regulations-for-all-rosewood-species

That statement is false. You can legally import / export from UK. Even the link you refer to says you can.

"Even if the instrument was made with Dalbergia or the other regulated woods that were acquired before January 2, 2017 - such as a used or vintage instrument - it still must be accompanied by a CITES certificate and marked pre-convention when shipping internationally."

Pre-convention cites certificate. Exactly what I got for importing a guitar with rosewood that was made before 2017. Guitar hace COA which had the year on it so that proved pre convention, and as the correct rosewood was listed, the application was processed. I sent pictures of the guitar to the agency aswell.

It's more likely there are some dealers importers that won't want to participate but agree there is no ban on the commerce. They're just making it hard hoping to slow down demand. 

Sephiroth

Andertons / Chapman guitars changed their 2017 lineup to ebony from rosewood dueto the cites regs coming into effect at the beginning of this year, so yes, businesses are changing what guitars they are offering due to the regs(even ESP with the ltd lineup). But to say it's illegal to import older guitars with rosewood is just a false statement. Even the link provided to back up the claim says you can import with the proper cites form marked pre-convention. Hoops to jump through? Yes. illegal, No. 

SteelEdge
Sephiroth wrote:

That's why some concrete guitar, specially collectibles ones with rosewood, have dramatically increased its price in EU / UK.You can't legally import them anymore from outside EU/UK.

 

Hope this clears things out: https://reverb.com/news/new-cites-regulations-for-all-rosewood-species

That statement is false. You can legally import / export from UK. Even the link you refer to says you can.

"Even if the instrument was made with Dalbergia or the other regulated woods that were acquired before January 2, 2017 - such as a used or vintage instrument - it still must be accompanied by a CITES certificate and marked pre-convention when shipping internationally."

Pre-convention cites certificate. Exactly what I got for importing a guitar with rosewood that was made before 2017. Guitar hace COA which had the year on it so that proved pre convention, and as the correct rosewood was listed, the application was processed. I sent pictures of the guitar to the agency aswell.

 

Sorry I meant "You can't legally import them anymore from outside EU/UK WITHOUT A CITES"

 

20 years working with customs.

 

I know what I'm saying.

 

Pre or not 2017, all rosewood needs CITeS for import / export

HateEvent

I think where the wires are getting crossed here is the fact that nobody is disputing that  

Big Daddy B
HateEvent wrote:

I think where the wires are getting crossed here is the fact that nobody is disputing that  

What? 

Pims

Hopefully within Europe that's not a problem <3. I almost bought that ouija guitar on ebay at the time

Sephiroth
SteelEdge wrote:

 

Sorry I meant "You can't legally import them anymore from outside EU/UK WITHOUT A CITES"

 

20 years working with customs.

 

I know what I'm saying.

 

Pre or not 2017, all rosewood needs CITeS for import / export

Agreed, what you meant to say is correct, but unfortunately that's not what you put, and that could confuse others who are trying to import /export out of UK/Europe.

It's just an extra hassle now to deal with when selling guitars abroad.

SteelEdge
Sephiroth wrote:

 

Sorry I meant "You can't legally import them anymore from outside EU/UK WITHOUT A CITES"

 

20 years working with customs.

 

I know what I'm saying.

 

Pre or not 2017, all rosewood needs CITeS for import / export

Agreed, what you meant to say is correct, but unfortunately that's not what you put, and that could confuse others who are trying to import /export out of UK/Europe.

It's just an extra hassle now to deal with when selling guitars abroad.

 

This is what I first said in my post:

 

"Any kind of rosewood in any guitar (or furniture or whatever) need CITES to be imported.Bubinga too."

You are right, my statement was wrong, but I clearly intended the "without a CiTeS" from my previous words.

Also put the link were that is very clearly stated.

I'd wish my english would be as good as my spanish....but sometimes it isn't

Big Daddy B
Sephiroth wrote:

 

Sorry I meant "You can't legally import them anymore from outside EU/UK WITHOUT A CITES"

 

20 years working with customs.

 

I know what I'm saying.

 

Pre or not 2017, all rosewood needs CITeS for import / export

Agreed, what you meant to say is correct, but unfortunately that's not what you put, and that could confuse others who are trying to import /export out of UK/Europe.

It's just an extra hassle now to deal with when selling guitars abroad.

I would also add I did have a pre-2017 guitar shipping in 2017 which required a cert.

HateEvent

We did also have the discussion where it was suggested that me completing a CITES export form for a pre-convention guitar - as per the guidelines set by the governing agency - was somehow illegal.  

Either way, I think we are all on the same page now. I know what the deal is anyway

Back to OP - I hope you manage to get it sorted out with minimal hassle mate!

Crazyfrase

Got a reply from ESP via email confirming what I needed. Thanks everyone for the help!

Pims

Awesome hope the guitar finds you well, try to post pics as ouija seeings are so cool!

Viperzzz

 Hi Crazyfrase,

I  applied for a PRE CITES export certificate for a Caparison guitar going to the USA about 5 months ago with  Australian land and Environment. They made me jump through absolute hoops to even get the certificate, had to sign stat declarations about how it came to be in my possession and then get an official letter from caparison stating it's specs/ species and date of manufacture which Caparison very kindly did. Last step before sending was to get an Export declaration number from customs which I never got around to doing.

I ended up getting the certificate but did not end up sending the guitar in the end as I was scared it might still get confiscated if the docs went missing in transit  or if the buyer didn't take appropriate import steps at their end, I wasn't overly confident in the buyer. Not worth the risk for me.

 It's very surprising they didn't make you take all the steps I had to do before issuing you with the certificate and allowing you to send.

I hope ESP will help you out like Caparison did with me. All the best.

kirkfan30

what kind of fucked up story is this? Did you import it to the UK or trying to export it out the UK ? Inside EU normally you wouldn't have any troubles...

 

Breadfan32

Big Daddy B
Breadfan32 wrote:

ESP 348

Glad it all worked out for you man.

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