E-II, honest opinions?

Updated
luke b.

yo guys,

 

Honestly im struggling to see why ESP made this line, im sure they play great etc but why on earth would anyone spend £1000+ on a guitar that doesnt say ESP on the headstock? 

 

literally its the only thing putting me off owning one.

 

Opinions?

JERRY CAM

As long as it's made the same way and held to the same standards what's on the headstock isn't as important as the instrument itself.

Rikki Tikki Tavi

Have to agree Jerry Cam. For the record my E-ii Eclipse showed up yesterday and first impressions are; looks great, quality instantly recognisable, plays great and sounds the business. Can't fault it. Very pleased.

JERRY CAM

Enjoy it Rikki !  I have an Eclipse and love it !

Steven M.

I honestly would never pay 1600-2000 for a guitar that didn't say Jackson, Gibson, ESP, Fender et all prominently displayed on the headstock. What a joke. Hello Jackson USA dinky, goodbye E II. 

Rikki Tikki Tavi

Depends on what the guitar is like, regardless of branding. I've played Fenders and Gibsons I didn't like even though they say Fender or Gibson on them.

You can get a Jackson for £200 with Jackson on it, suppose you're aware of this too...

Just my two penneth

Steven M.
Rikki Tikki Tavi wrote:

Depends on what the guitar is like, regardless of branding. I've played Fenders and Gibsons I didn't like even though they say Fender or Gibson on them.

You can get a Jackson for £200 with Jackson on it, suppose you're aware of this too...

Just my two penneth

i get it, I can clearly tell the difference between a 200 dollar Jackson and a USA made one.  Same with a Mexican fender  I have no problem with people who don't have the cash but want their favorite brand so they buy a similar spec instrument made in China or Indonesia. But if I'm paying that kind of cash for a brand. I want that brand displayed. If I didn't care about the logo on the headstock I would be looking at an off brand or lessor known start up not at an ESP. I own an ec-1000 it's just awesome. There's no chance in hell that I would pay for an EII eclipse. Now if it said ESP on it.... 

 

Rikki Tikki Tavi

Fair enough. But if the £1500 - £2000 price bracket guitars did say ESP on the headstock (as previously), what are they going to put on the £3000 - £3500 guitars?

In a sense they're all ESP (including LTD) and they need to show the difference in specs and prices in some way.  Hence the current re-branding.

 

 

Steven M.

They would put ESP on it. Just like Ibanez, Jackson, Charvel, Fender, Carvin, etc does with their high end products. It seems like ESP needs to do a little better market research into what people want and what they're willing to pay for it. 

Rikki Tikki Tavi

Most will agree NAMM 2016 will certainly be interesting for many reasons....Do folks think that ESP considered the changes to their branding of products before they made them?

If things change for NAMM 2016 how do we know they will 'revamp' to suit all of us? Without, of course, confusing anyone. Maybe that's not possible.

Does tha care to share with us who 'the few on the ground in the US' are specifically?

Pushead

The prevailing story about the ESP Standard to E-II change was to protect the ESP name in Japan.  ESP in Japan was only ever supposed to be "Custom Shop" / "Original Series" level guitars.  ESP made the "Standard Series" guitars for export to the rest of the world.  The "Standard Series" guitars were built and assembled in the equivalent of a production line, whereas the "Custom Shop" & "Original Series" guitars were built with one luthier doing (or overseeing) all of the work on a single guitar.

What happened was a few Japanese shops (or more likely a few Japanese individuals) started importing ESP Standard guitars from outside of Japan.  Because of the lower price but the same logo, Japanese consumers started purchasing the ESP "Standard Series" guitars instead of the "Custom Shop" guitars.  The move, first to "LTD Elite" and then "E-II," was a way to defend the ESP brand as their highest quality, non-traditional models.  (The Navigator brand is their high quality, vintage/traditional American guitar tribute line.)

It's an interesting strategy, and the E-II brand had to start at some time.  I'm curious to see how the decision turns out.  Other brands have had different strategies when it comes to the same set of circumstances.  Ibanez gives all of their lines the "Ibanez" logo, regardless of the quality level (some Ibanez get "Prestige" or other qualifications.)  Jackson went the same direction before being bought by Fender, but still works with the same idea.  Fender is pretty much the similar, only their lowest level guitars get the "Squire" brand.  Gibson has the Epiphone brand for their lower level guitars (and even a few brands below that).  But in the last few years, even Gibson has started making $700 guitars branded with the "Gibson" logo.

I can say that I understand and respect the decision making process on ESP's part.  But I'll also say that when used ESP Standard guitars are still readily available, I'll pick a used ESP Standard over a similarly priced E-II, even if the E-II is new. 

Madhat

I'm actually glad my Eclipse says ESP on the top  

Steve g.

hi all ive seen some of the e2 guitars and took my esp m2 standard to my shop to play. i found small problems with some e2 guitars, yes thay are still better then most all guitars in the price range, but so was the standard. to most ( myself aswell) the esp logo ment something. you dont see gibson, jackson and some others putting a different name on there standards, i have in my my 2 THE best guitar and others see its an ESP and know. the esp standard line was THE BEST guitar line made anywhere i hust thing ij you want sales up PUT IT BACK THE WAY IT WAS.... be on top and be proud of it and make the best.... ESP!!!!

Jay G.

new to ESP, i've been a gibson guy for many years. I couldn't decide which eclipse to buy, so i bought both. I found a used 08 standard and a '14 E-ii online and figured i'd try them out myself and return the loser.  I have to tell you, after playing them side by side i can't tell much difference between the two guitars. they really do sound and feel the same to me. I've been playing for many years and gig 2-4x month and needed a new axe. For me, i'm going to stick with the '14 E-II only because I liked it ever so slightly better and mainly becuase it was $200 cheaper than the standard. I dunno, $200 for it to say ESP on headstock ain't worth it to me. Maybe i got lucky but like everyone here says go out and play one. see for yourself. Take advantage of return policies  and try both. By the way, both kick butt and although i still love my LP standard the eclipse might be my number 1 guitar for a little while. I got the E-II for less than a grand and i think it's a steal. I've had gibsons i paid more for and had to do fretwork or adjustments to them. These both play very well. thats my .02

Rikki Tikki Tavi

I have an E II Eclipse also. Mine too is superb and my other axe is a PRS Custom 24. E II, great quality, sound, playability and value! Been told they will be £1700 in UK shortly. Def buying another ESP sometime, maybe ST-2....

Hans B.

I would never buy E-II anything. ESP or nothing. Too much cash for guitars with that ugly logo. The custom ESP prices are also ridiculous especially given that guitar popularity is at an all time low. I don't know what these guys are high on. They can only milk the popularity of their endosees for so much longer. This was a big insult to the export markets where they make most of their revenue.

Bottom line. You could have a $6,000 custom ESP and you would get less for that at a pawn shop than a LP standard. It's too bad because I would love to buy a new ESP. I can afford the $3-4k price but I just don't feel they are worth that much. The only ESP I would pay this price for is a white MX. I am actually looking for a pre '90 custom 24. Those guitars are worth the money. I could care less how many new bands are promoting E-IIs on stage. I was drawn to ESP because of James & Kirk along with Slayer, Scott Ian's older guitars and Stef's original 6 string Horizons. I ordered & negotiated my first KH-2 for $1440 out the door in '98. They had a JH-2 on the wall for $1799 which I really should've bought instead. This was before the lawsuit and I thought I would be able to buy one down the line. I really wanted an OFR and 24 frets at the time so the JH-2 was out. There was also an original bolt-on Ouija across the street at 48th at custom guitars for the same $1799. At 13 I had no idea how much these two models would skyrocket. I was just looking for the best deal. 

Maurizio O.

Too many brands, too much confusion, I don't understand this way of managing product lines.

At this point, if you want to buy an ESP, you have to study... E-II is a non-sense for me...

Possum

Just purchased an E-II Eclipse in the new Satin Black BB and I'm very impressed with the build quality and playability of this guitar. I've owned a USA Jackson WR1, both American Standard and Deluxe Strats, a USA BC Rich Ironbird and various partscasters over the years. This Eclipse is on par or better then any of my previous guitars. Very happy with the tone, feel and craftmenship. Great value at the current price. Night and day over the LTD line. I'm not sure what kind of madness goes into a $5000+ guitar other than a slicker paint job and some more exotic woods but I can't imagine it playing that much nicer than my $1750 E-II. I'm very satisfied with the value. I recommend one if you need a highly playable, pro quality guitar that's built to last.

scott s.

I just got The E-II MK-I Mille Petrozza guitar yesterday and it is not good. It's like the quality of an LTD. I am sending it back.  I have many standard ESP's and a custom shop one as well. The E-II's dont come close in my opinion.  I'm sad because I love the looks and features this guitar has and I kept looking at the pictures of it online and was getting so excited for it to arrive but I'm very dissapointed.

RGT

Sorry to revive this old beast but it's interesting to see whether the brand has grown better / worse / more consistent with age. It's 2017 now so it's been a good 4(?) years that the E-II wheels have been turning. No sign of it being mothballed. Has anyone got any new insights from the latest E-IIs? 

The last two comments summed up are: 1. (Possum) these are excellent,  and 2.(scott s) These are shite..... LOL

Personally I'm sort of in the.. 'dreamed of playing as ESP and now that I can afford the 1.5 - 2k price tag, they all say E-II' .. group.

 

Considering USA model now which is twice the price but I might be able to sell some organs and get a payment plan for the rest!

 

It's just, you don't see anyone complaining about the QA/QC of the US brand. But E-II looks hella inconsistent.

 

Thoughts????

 

Hypnotoad6969

Keep your eyes on eBay and Reverb for used mid 90s - mid 00s Standard Series.  Specs may be the same as the "E" series, but the overall construction, attention to detail, wood selection etc. seems inferior as compared to ESP's hayday.  I've tinkered around with a bunch of E2s just out of curiosity, and my 95 The Eclipse blows they out of the water in every possible way.  They are becoming more and more rare, but you can find a nice used 90s Standard Series on the used market for a grand or less, Cheaper, and better than an E2

HateEvent
Hypnotoad6969 wrote:

Keep your eyes on eBay and Reverb for used mid 90s - mid 00s Standard Series.  Specs may be the same as the "E" series, but the overall construction, attention to detail, wood selection etc. seems inferior as compared to ESP's hayday.  I've tinkered around with a bunch of E2s just out of curiosity, and my 95 The Eclipse blows they out of the water in every possible way.  They are becoming more and more rare, but you can find a nice used 90s Standard Series on the used market for a grand or less, Cheaper, and better than an E2

Reading your posts on here is akin to going into a grocery store; walking down the aisle displaying milk and cheese, getting to the next aisle and it being the same milk and cheese, then the next aisle being the same again. Over and over. Jesus wept.

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